Cabriolet

These words like Cabriolet, Phaeton, Victoria, Brougham, Coupe, and so forth probably have roots in the carriage trade and don't always have consistent definitions. Different manufacturers often use the terms as they like.

But as far as I can tell, the term Cabriolet usually refers to a convertible coupe, i.e. folding top and wind up windows. Certainly that applies to Fords and Chevies of the early thirties. Germans have used the term a lot, and usually for convertible coupes. My Webster's also says convertible coupe.

Now, what is a convertible coupe......?

Bill S

Albuquerque, NM

Try this on for size...

Covertible Coupe generally has two doors, glass windows (as opposed to side curtains),a rag top, two seats under the rag top and frequently has a rumble seat out in the elements.

Convertible Victoria generally has the same except it has all seats (usually four) under the rag top.

Cabriolet is usually a Convertible Victoria. In the United Kingdom it is called a Drop Head Coupe. Automobile manufacturers did not slavishly follow body nomenclature. An example of this is the 1936-7 Cord Convertible Victoria which was call by the factory a Convertible Phaeton Sedan!

Bob,

I think your question arose as a result of the lovely Mercedez Benz image that you have graciously provided for our website main page. You had it listed as a Cabriolet, and I changed it to Phaeton, being in a hurry and not knowing exactly what it is supposed to be referred to. Actually I think it is a Cabriolet B in Mercedez terminilogy, but haven't had a chance to look that up yet. I chose the word Phaeton because generally speaking Phaetons are 4 door convertibles.

But then again I think Volkswagon has a current model they are calling the Phaeton which is actually a closed car. Those wacky Germans! HA!

Thank you gentlemen for you help. It never ceases to amaze me the knowledge and helpfulness of the members.

Shawn, I captured the image of the Mercedes Benz at MeadowBrook this summer. Did you know the car hails from Indianapolis, your fair city. I never met the owner, but the car sure was stunning.

Thanks for reminding me! according to the directory it is a 290 cabriolet so that's what I will put up there!

Hate to be plugging my "Cadillac Database" again [www.car-nection.com/yann], but there's a LOT of stuff in there that CCCA members may find useful and that are not necessarily related only to Cadillac and LaSalle cars. This vast reference source currently numbers some 6,600 printable pages and includes more than 16,000 digital images. It deals mainly with the first 50-60 years of Cadillac although models up to 2002 are mentioned.

Here's the definition of "Cabriolet" from the "Glossary and Fact Finder" section, letters "A-C":

QUOTE Cabriolet: French word, derived from the verb "cabrioler" describing the rearing action of a prancing horse. It was used initially to describe a light-weight, open, two-seater, horse-drawn carriage generally fitted with a top that could be raised to protect the occupants in inclement weather. Later, among French coach-builders, it came to designate a convertible automobile for 2 or 3 passengers. Fleetwood adopted the term in 1927 to designate any custom-bodied closed cars with a fixed roof and a leather or cloth covering applied to the roof to resemble a convertible automobile; the term was a favorite with Fleetwood in the late Twenties and Thirties; it went out of style in the mid-Thirties but made a come-back in 1980 [check out the 1980 Cadillac brochure]. UNQUOTE

This further definition is from the Appendix to the "Styling" section of the Database:

QUOTE Cabriolet :  leading to public cab, was 2-wheeled, one-horse chaise with an open hood. A continental term for virtually any car with a folding top and roll-up windows.  Cadillac used the term in the thirties for models with fixed, leather or cloth-covered tops; the continental equivalent would be Faux Cabriolet (or dummy convertible). UNQUOTE

In France (where the word originated) today it simply means a "convertible", i.e. any car with a folding cloth or leather top, whether 2 or 4 doors and any number of passengers.

That is a very interesting resume, what can you tell us about "Brougham"?

I know Studebaker in the late twenties called the convertible model with a fixed windshield frame and roll up side windows a "Cabriolet" and the "Four seasons" version in 1931 with a drop down windshield but roll up side windows was still a "Roadster". Stude8

Once again, I recommend you check out the "Cadillac Database"; it's all there in the "Glossary and Fact Finder" section under letters "A-C", as also in the appendix to the "Styling" section:

http://www.car-nection.com/yann/Dbas_txt/facta-c.htm

and

http://www.car-nection.com/yann/Dbas_txt/sty_apdx.htm

You'll also find there a good 100 printable pages devoted to Cadillac's Eldorado Brougham models of 1957-1960:

http://www.car-nection.com/yann/Dbas_txt/brg_chap.htm

Anything else ? <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Veesixteen: I admit that I am a true blue Packard lover first, however I have visited your many times. Your site is the best I have seen and the most informative. I wish the PAC web site would be half as good and share the nformation more freely like your site does.

Thanks for the kind and encouraging words. I did compile the whole thing on my own, over a period of 2-3 years, and I am currently still responsible for all additions, deletions, updates. I donated the Database officially to the Cadillac-LaSalle Club, Inc.'s Museum and Research Center some years back.

There are some who say that we should limit free access to only paid-up club members. I disagree. Most of the Cadillac/LaSalle information and material that I accumulated over a period of 40 years, was essentially cost-free to me (it came from GM/Cadillac PR, dealerships, autoshows, swap meets and other generous collectors and hobbyists). In my opinion, therefore, the general information and photos that I have extracted from all this documentation and put on line should be equally freely available to all other auto enthusiasts. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I have to add a big Colorado THANK YOU, YANN! [color:"red"] to that. I love that data base and use it often.

Your a good man, Sir. We Cadillac Lovers owe you a great deal. I hope were you ever to make it out to Denver that we could meet. I am sure the RMCLC would be more than welcomeing, but I am certain you would have a great time in Severence with Howard, John and myself.

<img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />